The Proverbs 31 Ministries Podcast

Kaley Olson:
Well, hello, friends, and welcome back to The Proverbs 31 Ministries Podcast, where we share biblical Truth for any girl in any season. My name is Kaley Olson, and I'm here with my friend, Shae Hill.

Shae Hill:
Hey, Kaley. How are you —

Kaley Olson:
Hey, Shae.

Shae Hill:
— today?

Kaley Olson:
I am so good and so glad to be sitting next to you.

Shae Hill:
Same here.

Kaley Olson:
You look lovely.

Shae Hill:
Thank you.

Kaley Olson:
I wish our listeners could see how great your hair looks today.

Shae Hill:
Likewise. Oh, my goodness. So good to be with you. Thanks for having me.

Kaley Olson:
Of course. Well, Shae, you actually just finished recording an episode with our resident theologian,
Dr. Joel Muddamalle, and I'm excited to hear a sneak preview of that. But first, let me tell you guys a little bit about why I love getting to have you two on the podcast. First, we recognize that it's absolutely not normal to use the phrase “resident theologian.” We say that all the time at Proverbs. When we say that, what we mean is that we get to process biblical questions with Joel all the time because of where we work and the fact that Joel works here. But our listeners may not have the same access that we have to somebody like Joel who really, really, really, really knows the Bible.

So, you guys are going to start seeing or hearing Joel's name on a lot more episodes throughout the year, because we want to know more about what the Bible says about X, Y, Z. So, we thought, Why not put the mic in front of Joel and just record what he says for you? So, Shae, why don't you tell our listeners about what you and Joel are going to talk about today?

Shae Hill:
Yeah, so I mean, you talked about the purpose behind some of these conversations, and it's really just to bridge the gap between some of the everyday questions that we have as believers, but getting Joel, like you said, in front of a mic where he can answer with all of his wisdom and biblical Truth and just guidance honestly. He's so great about helping us all become better students of God's Word. That's really the heart behind today's conversation.

Maybe like you guys, I have some goals this year to dig more into my Bible, but, Kaley, I don't want to just read my Bible for volume and say that I covered a lot of ground this year. I want to really make sure that I dug into my Bible and read it the way that God intended the Scripture to be read. One of the things that Joel's really taught me ... I guess the key behind becoming a better student of God's Word is really digging into the context. So, that's what we're going to talk about in today's conversation.

Kaley Olson:
That is great and honestly sets me up well for a free resource that I have to tell our listeners about before we jump into today's conversation. There is a resource we created at Proverbs called, "How Do I Know Which of God’s Promises Are for Me?" I don't know about you, Shae, but you mentioned context and wanting to read the Bible well and know that you're correctly interpreting and applying Scripture to your life. But sometimes if you open your Bible and don't have the right tools that you need, you're not going to be able to do that well. So, there's a chance that you — alone in your sinful like human nature, and me too — can read the Bible and think, Oh, well, all of this is for me, when that's not exactly true.

So, this resource will equip you to understand the difference between promises, principles and proverbs. So that you aren't confused about what words you can hold God to keep in your life. You guys can grab this resource for free using the link in the show notes for today's episode. If you're looking for a study guide that dives even more in depth, you can purchase our Keep Holding On study guide that's also linked — another really great resource. All right, Shae, I'm excited to hear your conversation with Joel. So, let's dive in.

Shae Hill:
Joel, I'm so excited that we're back here on the podcast today. We have been having these conversations where we're identifying some questions that all of us carry in our hearts and our minds, and you have been helping us walk through these questions with some theological truths. It's been so helpful for me personally.

So, I'm so excited that we're back here today, but for today's conversation, I was thinking about how so many times I've sat down to have my quiet time or I've been reading my devotion or maybe I'm preparing to share something or studying to prepare for something and I have this lightbulb moment. If you are a creative, you know this moment, where it's like things are just flowing and it's so helpful, because sometimes there are days where we're just not inspired.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
So true.

Shae Hill:
Ideas are not flowing, so you're on a roll. Things are coming together. My fingers can't type fast enough to capture what I'm thinking. Then I have this still small voice that is the Holy Spirit, but also, I think you as a friend and just our theologian on staff have trained me to think this way of: Is what I am capturing or writing or thinking or understanding — whatever word you want to insert there — is this the correct context that the Scripture is in, and am I interpreting it the correct way? It's like the best pause because I know that it's good for us, but it's also challenging to sometimes discern. I just don't feel equipped sometimes to be able to walk through those scenarios. Has this ever happened to you?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Oh, yeah, absolutely, Shae. First of all, I just want to say congratulations for having that moment. I mean, that is a true sign of just your love for the Scriptures. I think any of you who are listening and you're saying, "Hey, I really care about God's Word, and I want to rightly understand it," because we know that there is goodness and Truth and eternal value inside of Scripture. So, with all that in mind, yeah, absolutely. We want to make sure that we're reading the Scriptures appropriately. So, I've got a little bit of a confession for you, something that I don't think you know this at all. My freshman year of Bible college, Shae, I was put on academic probation.

Shae Hill:
What?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yes. Yeah. So, I say that —

Shae Hill:
Is this the first time that you've shared that publicly?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
I think it might be. I think it might be.

Shae Hill:
OK, we are in for a treat today.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
You're in for a treat.

Shae Hill:
OK, tell me about that.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Well, I can tell you that there was a 7 a.m. English grammar class that —

Shae Hill:
7 a.m.?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
— was brutal.

Shae Hill:
I thought classes didn't start until 8 a.m. That was the worst.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
The Greek class started at 8 a.m., but I have to take the English grammar class in order to qualify for the Greek class, which —

Shae Hill:
At 7 a.m.?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
It was brutal, Shae. It was brutal.

Shae Hill:
They may or may not know this about you, you are not mornings.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
I'm not mornings.

Shae Hill:
You're not mornings.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
I'm a night owl, not a morning person. A true tragedy for a theologian, because pretty much all the great theologians of ancient past woke up at the crack of dawn, before that, in order to do their five hours of Bible reading before. So, that is not me, but I say that just as an encouragement. For those of you who are listening who are like, "Oh, my gosh. Is Joel going to say something?" It absolutely derails.

Have I mishandled God's Word? I just want to encourage you. Listen, we are in this together, and there's goodness here for us to grow and learn and to move forward with. I would say the first thing is, Shae, that God in His infinite wisdom intended and designed Scripture to be written, processed and presented to us within the context of actual space and time, in actual culture and society. So, here's an example, Shae. If I were to say, "Hey, where were you on 9/11?" what would you say?

Shae Hill:
I was in the first grade.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Wow. OK, cool. So, Shae, I was in high school. So, actually, I've said this before in a different teaching environment. I had a gal raise her hand, and she goes, "I was in my mother's womb," at which point I thought I have become old absolutely.

Shae Hill:
I am old.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
I am old. Now, what's super interesting, Shae, all I said was 9/11. So, how did you know ... what context do you have of that phrase “9/11”?

Shae Hill:
A memory.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
OK. What was your memory?

Shae Hill:
That I was in the classroom, and my mom checked me out of school unexpectedly. I didn't have a warning, and I didn't know why she was checking me out of school. Then she took me home, and I learned about what had happened.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
But, Shae, all I said were a phrase, couple of words like 9/11. So, how did your brain make a connection between these words to an actual event that is so specific, [that] was so tragic that it's had ramifications for our world really?

Shae Hill:
I guess I have a personal lived experience even though it was a national —

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Tragedy.

Shae Hill:
Really a global tragedy.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yes. I mean the world was shook.

Shae Hill:
So it was something we all went through, but we also all have our own —

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Experience with it.

Shae Hill:
— experience of where we were and what happened.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
So depending on your experience, you can relate to it. In my experience, I was, I think, a freshman or sophomore in high school. I won't ever forget getting into a science class, and the TV was on. We watched live as the second plane hit the second tower. I mean it was horrific and tragic and as a teenager trying to make sense of all of this. I point all this out to say that you and I today really have the benefit in some senses of being able to be so close to the context, the social setting, the phraseology.

My kids now, when I say something like 9/11, we actually have to give more context around it. We actually have to describe what we're talking about. Notice why, and it's even between you and me. I was a freshman or a sophomore in high school. You were in first grade. My kids weren't even born yet. So, the further away we get from that source moment, from the actual moment in history and in culture, the more work it takes for us to get under the scenes of this and figure out what's actually taking place.

Shae Hill:
Yeah, because it's learned, not lived.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
That's exactly right.

Shae Hill:
Yeah. When something's lived, you're like, "I was wearing this. I saw this. It smelled like this." You have that whole experience, but when it's learned, it's harder to bridge that gap.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yeah. So, when we approach the Bible, one of the things that's so important for us to recognize is that the Bible was written ultimately by a divine author. God Himself wrote the Bible, and yet God also used over 40 human authors to pen 66 books over the course of 2,000 years across three languages in three continents. All of this is pointing to one cohesive story, and every one of these human authors and every one of these books that we have in the Bible is rooted in an actual story and an actual historical, cultural context. So, I want to give a couple of things ... to give us as a guardrail. Often when we look at the Bible, one of the challenges that we have is we're looking for policies everywhere. We want the Bible to always be A plus B equals C. That's understandable.

Wouldn't it be nice if the Bible was just a concordance, and we just said, "Hey, I'm struggling with anxiety"? So you just go to the A, and then you see all the verses, all the stories, about anxiety, or I'm really struggling with my favorite sports team that keeps losing unexpectedly. So, you go to, I don't know, maybe the Philadelphia Eagles. You open it up, and you're like, "Oh yeah, this is why they keep losing all the time." That's a joke. I'm just kidding, but you get the point. Wouldn't it be nice if the Bible was like that? Yet the Bible isn't. The Bible is a story; it's narrative. There's different types of writing. There's historical narrative and poetic narrative, and there is history that is presented as a song that is poetic in nature. So, there's a conflation of all of these things.

Each of these poetic structures, these narrative styles, impacts the way that we read. So, while we want policy, what the Bible actually more often presents for us is principle. This is actually really helpful, because what it does is instead of trying to figure out A plus B always equals C, what the Bible's actually doing for us is giving us a 360-degree view of what A actually is, of what B actually is, and how we can understand C. If we can understand the principles that are at play and we learn how to separate the policy that might've been true to the ancient Israelites in a specific setting versus the principle that is at play for them that actually applies to us today, these are some of the guardrails that we can safeguard ourselves from so that we don't take Scripture out of context.

Shae Hill:
Have you ever felt frustrated that God's Word didn't read A plus B equals C?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
All the time.

Shae Hill:
OK.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
All the time.

Shae Hill:
Because I have for sure, especially when I'm going through desperate —

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Going through something.

Shae Hill:
Yes.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Honestly, we get text messages all the time, just our friends here at Proverbs or just in ministry or on Instagram. It's just like, "Hey, what are the verses on this? What are the verses on that topic or that theme?" That's understandable. We were talking with our friend and mentor Lysa TerKeurst recently, and we were actually on tour. One of the things I've said on tour is that we have a propensity as human beings to try to short-circuit the process. We want to get to the destination as fast as possible.

Shae Hill:
We want the answer.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
We want the answer. Instead what God is often leading us to is not to go under a short circuit or go around, but the most important preposition throughout all of Scripture, I would argue, is the preposition “through.” We have to go through in order to really get to the other side. So, it's a natural desire to want that, but it really does take humility to then be able to say, God and His infinite wisdom determine that for our best interest; it's actually better for us not to have it. Because if we can be formed as humans to regain our true humanity, we can actually flex in any situation, circumstances, any type of suffering or struggle, any type of joy or celebration to be authentically truly human and bear the image of Jesus.

Shae Hill:
Yeah, that's so good. So, what I thought would be helpful for me personally, but also for our listeners today, is to look at one verse in the Old Testament and one verse in the New Testament. I want you to unpack that with all of the context and information as if you were looking at it for yourself with the training that you have, with the wisdom that you have, with the help of the Holy Spirit. How can we look at these verses and know that we're reading them for what God intends for our hearts and minds to receive them as?

Then hopefully, along the way I would pray and hope that we can glean some best practices for how to read our Bibles in the future and know that when we have that self-check, Am I reading this in the right context? We can be reminded of these things. So, will you get us started with our first verse, which is Jeremiah 29:11. I'll read it in the CSB, and it says, "‘For I know the plans I have for you’—this is the Lord's declaration—‘plans for your well-being, not for disaster, to give you a future and a hope.’"

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yeah, that's so good.

Shae Hill:
Who hasn't seen this?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Who hasn't?

Shae Hill:
On —

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
A coffee mug?

Shae Hill:
— a mug? Yes.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
A T-shirt.

Shae Hill:
A sweatshirt.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
A hoodie.

Shae Hill:
A tea towel in a kitchen.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yeah, I've seen that too.

Shae Hill:
You don't know what that is, do you?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
I don't.

Shae Hill:
Oh, my gosh. OK.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
What is a tea towel?

Shae Hill:
It's like a pretty towel that hangs in your kitchen.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
I have seen this, and they make me so mad and frustrated. Why are they there?

Shae Hill:
They're just pretty.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
It's so inefficient. I've actually used those before to wipe my hand.

Shae Hill:
And then got in trouble.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Got in so much trouble. Yeah, y’all, just don't do that. I just think it's inefficient. OK, back to the Bible.

Shae Hill:
Jeremiah 29:11.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yeah. OK. Actually, Shae, I'm going to throw a fast one on you. I'm going to use a different Bible translation. You're like, "What?"

Shae Hill:
I thought I was doing the right thing by bringing the CSB. All right. Let's go.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
You are. I love the CSB.

Shae Hill:
What do you have?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
I'm going to actually read from NIV, because I think to your point, there are verses that actually start to become anthems, and they become things that we hold really near and dear, especially if you grew up in the church. There might be a specific translation that you understood it and heard it. So, if you're just to quote it from your brain, you would go to that translation.

Shae Hill:
Yeah, people are like, "That's my life verse."

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
That's my life verse. Exactly.

Shae Hill:
There are ones that —

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Exactly. OK, so Jeremiah 29:11. I'm going to read from NIV, and it says this, "'For I know the plans I have for you,' declares the Lᴏʀᴅ, 'plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future.'" So let me give you one of the ways that this verse is often, or can be, misread. Again, this is honest. I've misread it in this way. So, one of the ways is, we think, OK, if things aren't going our way, if we have hardship or rejection, well, you know what?

Jeremiah 29:11 is a promise that is given to you and me. Don't you know it says that God has plans for us? Look at the plans that God has for us, plans for prosperity, plans for us not to be harmed, plans to give us a hope and a future. So, Shae, if you're down and out, don't you worry, sister. God's got you. I'm being a little —

Shae Hill:
Lighthearted.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
— lighthearted about it.

Shae Hill:
But it's true.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
But it's true. So, what's actually happening here? First of all, look at this: the verse. If I were to work through this exegetically and we're do Bible study together, I would ask us to just ask some questions. Who's writing this verse? So this is the prophet Jeremiah. Who is the prophet Jeremiah writing to? He's writing to the Israelites. What is the context of the Israelite situation? What's happening in their life? So this specific verse is written to the people of Israel, and what it's actually doing is, it's presenting a policy for the people of Israel. Super important. It's a specific promise that's being given to the people of Israel who are actually in Babylonian captivity.

Shae Hill:
From God through Jeremiah.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
From God through Jeremiah, who's a prophet speaking these words of promise and Truth and hope to the people of Israel who are in Babylonian captivity. They were under oppression. They longed for a promised future of restoration that actually God promised to give them. So, I'm thinking first, What did this verse mean to the original audience? For the original audience, the Israelites, this idea of the plan to prosper was located in a very specific historical and social expectation. The Israelites were in a land that was not their own. They were in exile, and they longed to go back to Jerusalem.

Now, this principle — this policy that was true for the Israelites — it is embedded with a principle that is true for us today. So, I want to show how we separate the policy for the Israelites to the principle that is true for us today. So, the principle for us today is that 1) We can both say ... last time I checked, "Are you under Babylonian captivity?"

Shae Hill:
I'm not.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
You're not. The Babylonians have not, right? OK. But we are feeling oppression. We do sometimes, feel as the people of God, like we're living in a land that's not our own. We belong to the Kingdom of God. Our allegiance is to Jesus. Yet we have to figure out how to live as faithful citizens of the Kingdom while living in this world. We do have some of those same feelings that are present there, but for the Israelites, the fulfillment of their promise happened historically. The Israelites were allowed to go back to Jerusalem. There's a rebuilding all that took place. Then there's this spiritual fulfillment with Jesus and the cross.

So, here I want to point this out. So, our prosperity for us today, our good fortune, this is the principle here. It's actually found in the salvation we receive from Jesus. Our hope is a past accomplishment. What Jesus does on the cross that anchors our confidence to the promise that Jesus is going to come back. Our future is the reality of the new heavens and the new earth. This land is not our own right now, and that God's going to come back and make all things new.

So, what was true for the Israelites that Jeremiah is speaking specifically to, we can be like, "Oh, historically, those promises were fulfilled," but embedded inside of those promises are principles that can be applied to you and me today that we can have great comfort from, that can ease this as we're really struggling. So, this is an example of the difference between a policy and a principle and how we can take a text that was aimed and directed toward a specific group of people and not claim a promise that wasn't made to us but still glean a principle that is so powerfully encouraging for us today.

Shae Hill:
That's good. OK, say that again. Not to —

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Claim a promise.

Shae Hill:
— claim a promise that's not for us but to glean a principle.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
A principle that's so beneficial and encouraging for us.

Shae Hill:
Yeah, I think that's so true, because I feel like the temptation or the error here with this verse would be to think, like you said, God's going to work all this out, but to look at what He's already done through Jesus, to look at where we're headed as believers, which is heaven. It doesn't make these words untrue. It would be an error to claim these promises for me personally today given the context.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
So a quick tip is, OK, if a promise was made, who is it made to? Do we find anywhere else in Scripture that specific promise was fulfilled? If it was fulfilled, how was it fulfilled? In that, we're always like ... This is a technical term, our hermeneutical lens, the key by which we're understanding the Scriptures, is Jesus. Jesus is the key. So, what are the promises made to Israel and how does Jesus on the cross fulfill those? As He fulfills those things, how does that change our lives today?

Shae Hill:
Yeah, I think that's good. Because oftentimes I can read and say, "What does this mean for me?" But really, I think it would be better for me to read a verse and say, "What does this tell me about Jesus?" So OK, let's go to the New Testament. Another verse that we may have seen on a mug or a tea towel.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
We're not going to see any more on tea towels, because everybody is like, "You know what? Yeah, tea towels don't make sense."

Shae Hill:
OK, OK. We'll have to maybe take a poll about the tea towel situation, but let's look at —

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Let's not. I feel like I'm going to lose. I don't like losing.

Shae Hill:
Yeah. Especially at a women's ministry —

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
For sure.

Shae Hill:
— I feel like there's probably some tea towel people around here. All right. So, Romans 8:28 says in the CSB, which you may read another translation. Are you going to do that?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
No, I'm not. We're going to go [with the] CSB.

Shae Hill:
OK, this one we're sticking with the CSB. OK.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yes.

Shae Hill:
So it says, "We know that all things work together for the good of those who love God, who are called according to his purpose" (CSB).

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
OK, I'm going to put you on the spot. How have you heard this just thrown around in your life?

Shae Hill:
I think how I've heard this or how I may have interpreted as myself, even as a younger believer, as a child would be: No matter what's going on, God's going to collect all these pieces, whether it is my mistakes, my sin, things that have happened to me, and eventually, all of this is going to work together for good. The same tone as Jeremiah 29:11 of just like "Hold on, sister. The good's on the way."

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
The good's on the way.

Shae Hill:
Yeah, like that.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
OK, so that's super good. I think what you also showed here ... I'm going to give again some technical terms that we're going to use everyday language. The technical terms are “anthropocentric” and “theocentric.” So, an anthropocentric is a human-centered view or way of reading the Bible. Theocentric is a God-centered view or way of reading the Bible. I think it's so easy for us to slip into a human-centered way of reading the Bible. So, what do we do with Romans 8:28? One, there's some historical, social, cultural context. Paul writes probably his most important letter ever to the church in Rome. It's delivered by Phoebe, who is a deaconess. She's a woman who is a brilliant orator and delivers this letter to this church.

All this stuff is very important. There's some background that is important. There was a time where there's Roman emperor who actually exiled all of the Jews who were living in Rome because there's some chaos that was happening and kicked them out. So, the Jews had to be kicked out, and then all of a sudden, some years later, a new emperor comes and says, "Hey, you all can come back in." So imagine that. Imagine being forced to leave your home for years at a time, then coming back expecting everything to be good, but life just kept going on, and your chair at your dinner table is now occupied by somebody else. Your parking spot that you always parked in all the time is now being filled by some yahoo.

All this stuff is happening, and you're wondering, What happened? Why is this happening to me? In this context, Paul is pointing out an eternal Truth. This eternal Truth is not human-centered; it's God-centered. So, here's one of the first things I think we need to do when we're looking at a verse like this is we want to look at the immediate context of the verse. So, we read Romans 8:28: “We know that all things work together for the good of those who love God, who are called according to his purpose” (CSB). But I want to start thinking, OK, what's happening in verses 29 and 30? What's happening in verses 28 and 27? This is immediate context.

Let's just read [verse] 29: “For those he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, so that he would be the firstborn among many brothers and sisters” (CSB). Then let's look up, if you start in verse 18, and I'll just summarize it: There's all this stuff about groaning and suffering, but then this glory that comes, this beauty that arises, essentially from the ashes. So, what does Romans 8:28 actually mean? “We know that all things,” so what are those “all things”? Everything. It's everything. “We know that all things work together for the good” ... Now look at the condition, “of those who love God, who are called according to his purpose.” Then it actually connects the all things working together for the good; it gives it a definition.

What is that definition? It's being conformed to the image of Jesus. So, a human-centered view of this verse is going to be like: All my wishes are going to be fulfilled, all my desires. Your setback is just a setup for a future overcoming. It's like, "Well, no." What this text and context is actually saying is, Sis, your suffering, the pain, the desire to have a child and [it] not coming to pass, the pain of losing a sibling, the pain of a relationship that you thought would be unshakable and now is absolutely shattered, none of this is meaningless.

If you're called by God, if you love Him, if you follow His ways, even all of these painful, horrific things that you have endured on this side of eternity, there's a good God who's going to in a mysterious way work these things for good. But what is the good? Paul gives it to us. The good is being conformed to the image of Jesus. It's sanctification. The ultimate good that we're actually longing for aren't found in things but in the one who's created all things, the one who sustains all things, and that's Jesus Himself.

Shae Hill:
It's so interesting to have this conversation because what I'm realizing is I think it can be looked down upon obviously to misapply these verses, and it can be seen like people just want to use it for what they think. But also, sometimes I think it's just not knowing, because actually, what I'm hearing from you is misapplying these verses from their original meaning or God's true meaning will actually really set you up for some disappointment with Him.

Because if you think in these certain ways that God's going to make all these things work together for good and it's like the good that I'm defining or the good that I think my life should be defined by and God doesn't do that, you're going to end up really disappointed in Him. So, not only do I feel like this conversation is helping us become better students of the Bible, but it's helping us just guard our hearts and set ourselves up well to have a realistic view of the Scripture and a better view of God.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yeah, that's so good.

Shae Hill:
So to close today, do you have any study tools that you would recommend for us?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yeah, because I know, Shae, people are like, "Wait a minute, how did you know that context about Rome? What do you know about that emperor? How in the world?"

Shae Hill:
I would say too, just for the person that's wanting to read through the Bible in a year, for that person, what are some tools that are really going to come alongside them and help them fulfill that?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Yeah. So, for the first time ever, I've made a personal decision to read through the Bible in a year chronologically. So, I'm doing that for 2024, and I'm super excited about it. We're going to do it as a group with a bunch of people. So, one of the tools that I'm actually using personally is the CSB Day-by-Day Chronological Bible. The reason why I love it is because inside of the Bible is actually built-in study notes so that you can get an understanding of the narrative story that's taking place. It's all broken up into scenes, which is super helpful. Then yeah, so I think that's super helpful, but a couple of free resources: Bible Gateway, super helpful; Bible Hub, incredibly helpful; Blue Letter Bible, super, super helpful.

I use personally Logos Bible Software for all of my study. I know you use it as well. They have a free study Bible called the Faithlife Study Bible; that's digital. Yo, it is so epic. It has videos. If you're studying about Rome, it has videos embedded in it, so you can see ancient Rome. It has articles by brilliant scholars that help you unpack all of that. All of that is super helpful, but I think if you're just saying, "Hey, what is the very first thing that I need?" I would look into ... I've personally been using the CSB a lot. I would look into the CSB Study Bibles that they have out there that are just very helpful, because those study Bibles give you the first layer of commentary notes.

Shae Hill:
That's nice.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
That's helpful.

Shae Hill:
It's like a one-stop shop. If you're doing your Bible reading, you can also just have it right there. Yeah. Another resource that I'll mention that I've used as a girl on the go, I need something that I can access quickly but also something that I can understand, and a commentary that's been so helpful to me is called The Enduring Word Commentary. We'll link all these in the show notes in the description below, but I love that, because it has commentary on every single chapter in the Bible. I wouldn't say it goes verse by verse, but I would say it's very extensive. Not only do they break down verses and teachings, but they also provide insight from other biblical scholars of their brilliant study notes. So, I've used that a lot of times.

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
Oh, NET Bible has some phenomenal study notes.

Shae Hill:
N-E-T?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
N-E-T study notes are scholarly but accessible.

Shae Hill:
OK, that's amazing. OK. Well, thanks. Is there anything that we didn't talk about today that you want to mention?

Dr. Joel Muddamalle:
I just want to know, how do we make sure those little towelettes don't show up in more places? Because we can't keep doing this. It doesn't make sense to me.

Shae Hill:
I'm sorry. I don't know what to say. We have to cut. I'm sorry. That's not what I was expecting him to say.

Shae Hill:
Well, there's that. We can't solve all the world's problems today, can we? We'll see you next time.

Kaley Olson:
OK, Shae, can I make a comment that has absolutely nothing to do with the teaching?

Shae Hill:
Maybe. I feel like you're going to make it anyway. So, go ahead.

Kaley Olson:
Can we talk about the tea towel?

Shae Hill:
We can talk about the tea towel.

Kaley Olson:
I agree with Joel.

Shae Hill:
I understand your perspective.

Kaley Olson:
I'm a Southern girl at heart —

Shae Hill:
I know.

Kaley Olson:
— who should appreciate a good tea towel. Listen, I appreciate the point.

Shae Hill:
I know. I appreciate the tea towel. However, I do see that it's not the most useful.

Kaley Olson:
It's not the most useful, and I appreciate them as a gift, but they sit in the bottom of the basket —

Shae Hill:
They collect.

Kaley Olson:
Because if I'm not allowed to use it and they don't really absorb well and I don't want to get it dirty, then it's cute.

Shae Hill:
Listen, I think what I like about the tea towel is that I get very overwhelmed by holiday décor, and the tea towel makes me feel like I'm ready to ring in fill-in-the-blank holiday.

Kaley Olson:
That's true.

Shae Hill:
That's where I'm at with the tea towel.

Kaley Olson:
It's like the finishing touch on just cleaning your house and someone's coming in your kitchen, a nice candle.

Shae Hill:
We are all entitled to our own tea towel opinions here on the podcast.

Kaley Olson:
That's great. That's great. We can all coexist together as friends and family.

Shae Hill:
We can.

Kaley Olson:
There is absolutely no way for me to —

Shae Hill:
There's room for you here, friend.

Kaley Olson:
There is, but there's also no way for me to tie a tea towel into what you guys talked about today. But I do have to just say that is a big deal episode, because what you guys did was help us learn how to read and correctly apply Scripture, which we talked about at the beginning is so important whenever we're wanting to take our Bible-reading time more seriously and grow in our relationship with the Lord. We have to have context, and we have to know how to do it well. As a ministry, our heart is not only to meet you where you are with trustworthy biblical content but also to equip you for you to be able to do it on your own and for you to understand and apply it to your own life. So, thank you guys for this episode.

Shae Hill:
I enjoyed it. It was fun. Friends, wherever you're listening today, if you want to keep going with this practice of digging deeper into Scripture on your own, we have put together a free resource that will be so helpful for you called "How Do I Know Which of God’s Promises Are for Me?" With this guide, you'll be equipped to understand the difference between promises, principles and proverbs so you aren't confused about what words you can hold God to keep in your life. You can get it for free by using the link in our show notes below.

Kaley Olson:
It's a great resource.

Shae Hill:
It's great.

Kaley Olson:
It's free and you can just print it off.

Shae Hill:
I love free stuff.

Kaley Olson:
Tuck it in the pages of your Bible as you start this year. Also, to make a true study out of God's promises, you can get the Keep Holding On study guide linked in the show notes. This is such a great study of 30 promises found in God's Word that will build your faith as you gain a deeper understanding of what Scripture says about His promises, His character, and how He truly is faithful.

Shae Hill:
So good, I can't wait for that study, Kaley. Friends, thanks so much for tuning in today. As always, at Proverbs 31 Ministries, we believe when you know the Truth and live the Truth, it changes everything.