The Proverbs 31 Ministries Podcast

Kaley Olson:
Hello, friends. Thanks for tuning in to The Proverbs 31 Ministries Podcast, where we share a biblical Truth for any girl in any season. I'm your host, Kaley Olson, and I'm here with my co-host and my friend for today's show ... No, not just for today's show.

Amanda Bacon:
[We’re friends] all the time.

Kaley Olson:
You're Amanda Bacon. Welcome, Amanda.

Amanda Bacon:
Hi, Kaley.

Kaley Olson:
How are you?

Amanda Bacon:
I'm great. How are you today?

Kaley Olson:
I'm doing great. It's Friday, and we're ready for the weekend. But, Amanda, I'm not sure you've ever co-hosted the podcast for me before. I know you've taught on the show a couple times, but I do want to give our listeners a chance to get to know your personality before we get into the show — because I've known you for almost 10 years, which is wild. We met at She Speaks back in 2015 or '16.

Amanda Bacon:
Something like that.

Kaley Olson:
And so I know all the fun things about you, but will you enlighten our friends [who are] listening and share a bit about yourself? Where are you from? What's your fam like? What do you do here?

Amanda Bacon:
Well, this is fun, Kaley. Thanks for having me today.

Kaley Olson:
Of course.

Amanda Bacon:
Yeah, guys, so I've been on staff at Proverbs 31 Ministries for almost seven years, which is so fun. And I have been on Lysa TerKeurst's team the whole time and just love my job there. It's morphed and changed, and I run content on some of the platforms that she's sharing her words and her writing on. I work on her book projects. Also, a new part of my role in the last year is ... You guys all know Meredith Brock, the co-host of the show. So now I serve also as her executive assistant and [help with] all the things, meetings, and all sorts of fun things with both Lysa and Meredith.

Kaley Olson:
Praise the Lord. You're the gatekeeper to the calendar, and we love you.

Amanda Bacon:
I love it. I love it. And my family — it's a whole thing. I'm the mom of eight kids. I've got adult kids; I've got middle schoolers and high schoolers. I think I have five teenagers currently.

Kaley Olson:
Oh my gosh.

Amanda Bacon:
My kids are ages 11 to 22, and I've got four boys and four girls.

Kaley Olson:
Wow.

Amanda Bacon:
Three are adopted. Five I give birth to. And here we are.

Kaley Olson:
What do you call your kids?

Amanda Bacon:
The Bacon Bits.

Kaley Olson:
I love it. I love it.

Amanda Bacon:
It's a whole generational thing. We didn't make that up.

Kaley Olson:
It's so cute.

Amanda Bacon:
It's passed down.

Kaley Olson:
I mean, if your last name's going to be Bacon, you can use it.

Amanda Bacon:
It's a great one. And also I love the podcast, so it's so fun to be here. I host a couple different podcasts on my own. I have one where I help lead you into peaceful rest and sleep. It's called At Night: Prayer and Meditations for Peaceful Rest. And I also host a podcast for moms with my best buddy in Alaska, Ann Renee. It's called All the Mom Things. And if you're looking for some fun mom conversations and maybe some peace at night before you go to bed, you can check them out.

Kaley Olson:
Amen. What mom isn't?

Amanda Bacon:
I know. I know. And a fun fact about me — I'll just end with this — is that I grew up in Alaska, and I lived there for 30 years. And it is the best place to grow up as a kid.

Kaley Olson:
I can imagine. Because as a kid I never wanted to go to bed, and there's days —

Amanda Bacon:
The daylight.

Kaley Olson:
— months in Alaska where it's light all the time.

Amanda Bacon:
Right. Well, in the summer ... Winter and summer solstice are really important up north.

Kaley Olson:
For sure.

Amanda Bacon:
Because it actually really matters. In the summer, it's daylight 24 hours a day (where we lived in Alaska) around summer solstice.

Kaley Olson:
That is wild.

Amanda Bacon:
And we just had blackout curtains on the windows. The kids were like, "It's not dark out, it's not time for bed." And we're like, "We discuss this every year, guys. Remember? Every year." But then in the winter around Christmastime, winter solstice, it is dark all the time.

Kaley Olson:
That's crazy.

Amanda Bacon:
Where we lived, we had about five hours of daylight for a while there, and that's the darkest part of the year. But there are parts of Alaska way up north where it is dark from November to January, 24/7. The sun never rises. So that is just an interesting dynamic.

Kaley Olson:
Glad you're here in North Carolina.

Amanda Bacon:
Thank you so much.

Kaley Olson:
Yes.

Amanda Bacon:
So, Kaley, I have a question for you. Do you ever find yourself overwhelmed?

Kaley Olson:
Well, yeah. I mean …

Amanda Bacon:
Of course, right?

Kaley Olson:
Who doesn't?

Amanda Bacon:
Well, we are so excited here at Proverbs 31 that we understand that. We understand the struggles you listeners face. And so we wanted to create a devotional experience for you guys that meets you right where you are. And we're excited to let you know about a free, five-day devotional email series you can sign up for, and it's called, “God Will Get You Through This: Five Devotions for When You Feel Overwhelmed.” And when you subscribe, you'll get one each day sent straight to your inbox, and you can visit the link in our show notes.

Kaley Olson:
I love that. And that's a great transition into our episode today. And so it's taught by our friend
Sarah Frazer, who we're going to meet very soon. But Sarah is going to speak to the woman who is walking through something that she didn't sign up for, and I loved our conversation. I loved hearing from her, and I think you guys listening are going to be really encouraged. So let's go meet Sarah. OK, Amanda, I'm so excited to welcome our new friend to the show, Sarah Frazer. Welcome, Sarah.

Sarah Frazer:
Hi, ladies. Thank you so much for having me on. This is really, truly an honor.

Kaley Olson:
Well, Sarah, this is so much fun. Thank you for joining us today. And since Sarah is a new teacher on The Proverbs 31 Ministries Podcast, though she's not new to our Proverbs 31 Ministries family, we just want to do a formal introduction, and then we'll ask one question, Sarah — so be ready — to help you get to know her a little bit better. But first, Sarah is a writer. She's the wife of Jason, and she's the mom of five kids. She also has a background in missionary work and Bible teaching. We love that so much. And if you're familiar with our First 5 Bible study app, Sarah is actually one of our writers and teachers within the app. And she has a brand-new book, I Didn't Sign Up for This. So, hi, Sarah.

Sarah Frazer:
Hi, Amanda. Hi, how are you?

Kaley Olson:
It's so fun to see you on this platform, friend. Are you ready for a fun question?

Sarah Frazer:
Yes.

Kaley Olson:
So if you had an unlimited budget to travel anywhere in the world right now, where would you go and why?

Sarah Frazer:
Oh, this is such an easy question to answer because I've been thinking about this.

Kaley Olson:
It's like we knew.

Sarah Frazer:
My husband and I have some airline points that we've racked up, and so we're like, "Wow, maybe we should take a trip or something."

Kaley Olson:
For sure.

Sarah Frazer:
So we've been brainstorming different ways, that sort of thing. I think we can ... The airline tickets, right? They get you there. But I'm like, Then we'd have to come right back because we can't afford to do anything there.

Kaley Olson:
The journey is the trip.

Sarah Frazer:
Yes … but we've talked about Paris.

Kaley Olson:
Oh my gosh.

Sarah Frazer:
And we've just talked about going and staying just a week and just seeing all the sights, all the touristy things, eating all the food. I was telling him that I was looking online and they had food tours, and he goes, "I'm up for that."

Kaley Olson:
Sign me up. Walk it off.

Amanda Bacon:
Can we go?

Sarah Frazer:
Yes.

Kaley Olson:
Yes.

Sarah Frazer:
Walk it off, go eat, and go visit all the touristy things. So I think Paris would be my dream place to go.

Kaley Olson:
Sarah, I have been to Paris twice. And I will just tell you it is not as expensive as you think it would be over there.

Sarah Frazer:
Oh, good.

Kaley Olson:
You know what? I'm going to hang out and we're going to talk a little bit more after this because I'm going to convince you to go after we finish talking. But we have to get to your teaching today because Amanda mentioned a minute ago that your book is titled, I Didn't Sign Up for This: How to Rest in God's Goodness When Your Story Shifts. And that is what you're here to talk with us about today. And so, Sarah, I can't wait to hear a little bit more about your story and what God has taught you through it. So why don't you go ahead and take it away?

Sarah Frazer:
Thank you, ladies. We've all been there, right? We've all either whispered or said or thought the words, "I didn't sign up for this, this thing right here that I'm facing," whether it's something we had planned for and it didn't turn out or it's something we dreamed about and it just wasn't what we thought it was going to be … or something horrible just suddenly coming into our lives. We've all said those words or thought those words, I think. And I know I've been there. I've made plans and I've even prayed about it, right? I pray, asking God to open the door, and then suddenly something happens. There's a disappointment, a closed door, a twist, something that happens, and we think, Wait — did I hear God wrong? Did God lead me down this path knowing that this was going to happen?

I think when our circumstances suddenly shift, the first thing we start to do is doubt. I know, for me, I doubt myself. And then slowly I start doubting God. What is He doing? What is He up to? Has He forgotten about me? And then I move to this idea that maybe God was leading me and then just left.

The first time this happened was when we were adopting our daughter from China. I'll never forget that feeling of sitting there in this cold lobby at some government office in the middle of China. There were at least 20 families, probably more, all waiting to receive their children. We had prayed and filled out paperwork, prayed some more, filled out even more paperwork. We flew on a plane for 14 hours to this strange country, and then suddenly they hand us this little girl who we've looked at in the pictures and we've thought about and dreamed about and made plans for.

And I'll never forget the weight of her, the literal … putting her in my arms and that weight of her. Physically, she was so much heavier than what I guess I was expecting. She had four layers of clothes on because they believe in lots of layers of clothes in China. But I also remember looking at my husband, and we just looked at her and suddenly realized something was a little off. We didn't really know how to voice it at first, but going back to the hotel room, we peeled the layers off, undid her jacket, all of that. And we thought, Wow, her special needs, which we thought were one thing, are something totally different. And we even questioned, Wait — did they give us the right child?

We were just so confused. The next day, they had this small little ceremony where you promised to take care of this child and sign your name to officially become their parents. And I remember that morning before we left, I just cried and cried because I didn't know what that would mean. I was ready to do it, and I wanted this little girl, and she was the one who we had prayed for and who God had led into our life, but I just was so confused as to what her future would be, and that was so scary for me.

The main question I had in my mind was: How could God have led us here? We had filled out all that paperwork, and we had said “yes” to a ton of special needs, but I remember saying “no” to the type of special needs that she had. And that was when I first thought the phrase I didn't sign up for this.

But navigating that first year home was undoubtedly the hardest thing that we have ever done. Yet I learned two incredible, valuable lessons about life and about God during that season. The first was I decided that I was going to trust God's plan. And that was not an easy place to be, and I didn't come to that feeling or conclusion at first. But as I dove into Scripture that year that we brought her home and I just tried to pour myself into Scripture and prayer, I realized that I could trust God's plan — not because it felt good (because this was not a path that I thought was good) and not because I knew it was going to work out in the end (because I didn't know). I didn't know what her future was going to be. I didn't know if she would need lifelong care. We just didn't know that first year. But I decided that I could trust God because trusting God had nothing to do with me, and it had everything to do with who God was.

As I studied Scripture and I studied these stories in the Bible, especially the story of Moses, [I realized] we look at those stories and say, "Wow, their circumstances were so hard and difficult. But when they spoke to God or God spoke to them or they revealed something about God, it wasn't about His plan; it was about His character." And as I read the Bible, I was just overwhelmed with the character of God. He was sovereign. He was good. He was holy. He was righteous. All of these characteristics allowed me to trust His plan because I could trust who He was. And I clung to those truths about God that first year.

The second lesson I learned was that the best way forward when God interrupts our path is one day at a time. God designed [each day of] our lives to be in a 24-hour period. He created the sun and the moon and our Earth to rotate in this sort of set time. And there is a reason, I think, we get a reset every morning. I get a reset every morning of what God can do in my life, and I don't have to have my daughter's future all planned out. I wanted to. I wanted to know what her future was going to be. And I had to learn to say, Well, God, You see her future, and I can't, and that has to be OK.

And I think there have been times probably in your life when you have looked at this thing or this circumstance or these events and thought, Wow, I thought God was leading me, but now the path is really hard. I encourage you to remember God's characteristics and to remember that you can take one day at a time.

That was eight years ago. And over the course of my life, there have been lots of times when God has changed my path. My husband has had to leave jobs before that we felt were dream jobs. We moved our family overseas to do missions work, and then COVID-19 happened two months later. We recently moved back from the mission field and now are serving stateside. All through our life, we've made plans, and through a variety of situations, God has changed those plans, whether it's because of COVID-19 or a death or a job loss or a series of events out of our control … and you've probably also felt that pain and heartache of God changing your plans.

Even though we know the characteristics of God and we know that we can live one day at a time, I think there are three truths that help me face each of those days so I'm living daily in His Word, just living for today. And these three truths really help center my mind and help me remember that I can have joy and peace even today, facing these hard things that I'm facing.

The first one is that God will be faithful to provide. When there's been job loss in our family, God has provided a job. When I have faced death, God has provided comfort. Each loss that I've experienced, God has provided. And Philippians 4:19 says that God will supply all of our needs. And in the context of that, Paul was talking about his physical needs, but I think it also applies to our spiritual [needs] and our emotional [needs] and all of those other needs we face when we have something hard in our path.

The second thing is that — and this is hard, I admit, this is so hard for me — God doesn't always answer [the question of] why. Oh, man, that is so hard. Because the first question I feel like I ask God is, Why?
I remember battling depression as a new mom having two tiny little boys, and I just remember asking God, Why do I feel so sad all of the time? Why? And I never really got an answer. And suddenly, one day, God just impressed on my heart that maybe there wasn't a reason why. And even if there was, would that be good enough? It was almost like He was saying, Sarah, if I told you why you had to face this hard thing, would that be good enough?

And I thought, No, it wouldn't. I don't think any reason you could tell me I would feel is OK. [I don’t think I would agree to] battle this because of this reason or whatever.

And instead, He said, Instead of “why,” ask “who.” Who is with you in this journey?
Obviously God is with us. He is … Like we talked about earlier, focusing on His characteristics: He is faithful. He is good and He is in control. Those can comfort us, but also who [else] in our journey is beside us? I had a husband who was supportive. I had other family members. I had church family. Focusing instead on why this is happening is going to take us down a path we don't want to go [down]. The [focus on] “who” is much better. And I think that we've all faced things in our lives — because we live in a sin-filled world — but the comfort comes in that God in His character doesn't change. He doesn't change who He is, and we can trust Him no matter what we face.

The next truth is that God still has good things for us. One of my favorite verses from that first year with our daughter … And then even more recently, our family has faced incredible hardship moving back from the mission field, and I have struggled with the idea of God's goodness in my life, but Psalm 31:19 is one of my favorite [verses in] Psalms now. And it says that God has “stored up" (ESV) — or I think the New King James and King James [versions] say "laid up" — goodness for those who follow Him. And that verse is just so encouraging to us to think that God is preparing good things for our lives.

I don't know about you, but maybe you're looking around at your life and wondering, Are all my good days past? Has God given me all the goodness that I'm going to have in this life?

And the answer is: no. No. God has goodness waiting for us that will never run out. And that is something that we can practice every day. Let me look for the goodness of God. Let me look for those little moments. I'll give you a little example, hopefully quick: Our kids started a new school this year, and one of our son's teachers … It turns out that she was our older son's teacher several years ago at a different school. She's at this school now, teaching third grade, and our son gets to have the same teacher that his brother had, and we loved her. She's a fantastic teacher. And when I saw that, immediately I thought, God, You're so good. You stored up this goodness. You knew this teacher would be here.

And the first day he met her ... This is our youngest son we also adopted from China. So we have a daughter and a son adopted from China. And our youngest son … She looked at him, and she said, "I remember when you came home from China." If you know my son, he is very proud that he is Chinese. He tells everyone that he's Chinese. He was just beaming. And I thought, Oh, the goodness of God. Those little things that He is preparing.

And then finally there is a powerful thing in remembering, and I talk about this in my book toward the end. Moses, at the end of his life, had led the people out of Egypt, parted the Red Sea, gotten the Ten Commandments and the entire law [from God] on the mountain ... They were on the way to the promised land. But they said, "No, we're not going to enter." So God said, "OK, you're going to wander for 40 years." At the end of the wandering, Moses was writing Deuteronomy. And I think you can sum up Deuteronomy with the word “remember.”

I don't remember how many times Moses says “remember,” but he says it a lot in Deuteronomy. And so I think about that. And Moses' last words to the people were to [tell them to] remember. And if you read through Moses' words, they were to remember two things: 1) They were to remember where they had come from. They were once slaves; they were once suffering in Egypt. And then 2) they were to remember what God had done. And Moses went through all of those events that happened in Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers ... He talked about all of those things that God had done for the people from the time they left Egypt. And then he talked about God's promises for them. And he said, "God has done this great thing, and He's going to do more great things for you."

So I think that's a good truth for us to remember: If you've accepted Christ as your Savior and you're a Christian, you were once a lost sinner, but God rescued you through the death and resurrection of Jesus, and heaven is waiting for you. I recently had a thought when I was thinking about suffering, and I thought: Suffering might be long, but eternity with God is even longer. So even if the suffering lasts our entire lives, it's a drop in the bucket of the no suffering we'll experience with God in heaven.

So when we face life's disappointments, we can hold on to the fact that our plans will change. It's not a “might” — they will change. But God's plans are fixed in heaven. And one of those verses that has been a comfort for me is Psalm 119:89, and it says "Forever, oh Lᴏʀᴅ, your word is firmly fixed in the heavens" (ESV). And then verse 90 says, "Your faithfulness endures to all generations; you established the earth, and it stands fast" (ESV). And then verse 91 says, "By your appointment they stand this day, for all things are your servants" (ESV). God's words will never change. They are fixed in heaven. They will never waver from what they say. And as we read His Word, we're reminded of who He is, what He is doing, and that He keeps His promises.

Kaley Olson:
Man, Sarah, thank you for sharing that and just sharing the hope that we can have in whatever we're facing today: If we stick with God and really trust Him, we can be made new on the other side of it. I think for people listening who are really walking through something hard, your story is so encouraging. And as you were teaching, I kept thinking about your book, I Didn't Sign Up for This, and how you started the episode. And I thought about how there are things we do sign up for that I think lead us to say, “Well, I signed up for this but not this."

So for example, for me, I signed up to become a mom in the process of my husband and me deciding to start trying to have children and start our family. I signed up for that next step. And I think I knew that I signed up for the hardship of carrying a baby, the late nights, the early mornings, like, the sacrifice of myself. I knew what I was committing to. And I think that you knew maybe some of what you were committing to whenever you went to China to adopt your sweet little daughter. But then there's the thought, But I didn't sign up for this. And it's almost like it slaps you in the face. Because adoption is a really good thing and starting a family is a really good thing … but when they're turned upside down, it really can leave you just questioning God, like you said, and wondering, Man, did I hear Him right? Did He leave me here?

And something that I've learned through our Therapy & Theology podcast that we have here at Proverbs 31 Ministries, with Lysa and her counselor, is the word “through,” which we talk about a lot, actually, on this podcast. You quite literally have to go through whatever you're facing. But I think, as believers, we're given the choice not only to go through it but we get the choice to see God's plan through it, even if it's not what we wanted.

Sarah Frazer:
Yes.

Kaley Olson:
I remember … Though I didn't have the same experience as you did when you found out your little girl had significant special needs that were going to change the trajectory of your life forever, in some ways I've experienced that when all of a sudden I was pregnant and then I wasn't. And I remember just the feeling of devastation. And you're right: You feel so alone. And there's this space before you decide, OK, God, I'll do this with You. And that space right there is, I think, maybe where some of our listeners are today. Maybe the Band-Aid has just been ripped, or maybe the rug has just been torn out from underneath them or the sky has fallen or whatever it is, and they are looking at their life, saying, "OK, either I'm going to figure out what God says about this and I'm going to see God's plan through or I've had enough and I'm done. I don't want this because I've been left too alone. And I feel like there is no goodness there."

So what would you say to the woman right now who's in the middle of that space, trying to decide, OK, God, am I going to trust You one more time?

Sarah Frazer:
I think that I would say first, for me, I don't think you can put a time frame on how long you have to be in that space. First, I would say that. I think for me, it was a good three or four months of wrestling with God and initially saying, I don't know if I'm going to trust You. I don't know if I'm going to trust You about this. I feel very betrayed by You and very hurt by my circumstances.

And so I would say first give yourself some grace and some time, and don't feel like you have to hurry through the season. Definitely grieve. I resisted grieving for a little while because I thought that meant that I wasn't trusting God. And so I thought, Oh, I have to just accept this because this is what God wanted. And if I grieve, it's like I'm questioning His leading in my life.

And so grieve and give yourself time. But also I think, for me, the turning point didn't happen in a day either. It wasn't like one day it was all better. It was a slow healing of just staying in His Word. I remember reading the Bible during that time, and it was only because I was in the habit of it. I had built that habit over many, many years. And so it just was a habit to read. I didn't feel like reading, but I read. So I would say just read the Bible, even if you don't feel anything, even if you feel angry. Because there were times where I felt like, Well, God, I see You promised this, and now this is happening, and I'm upset right now that this is what You would say in Your Word. And this isn't a reflection of my life. But just keep reading.
There was something else I was going to say ... but maybe just that: Just give yourself some time, and give yourself space to grieve it, and stay in His Word. And just keep praying, keep wrestling with it, with God. That's what I would say.

Amanda Bacon:
That's great. Sarah, I love that you mentioned those simple practices of staying in His Word and praying. And you also, in the middle of your teaching, talked about a simple practice that I've had to get really comfortable with, and that is taking it one day at a time. And I know that sometimes when we're in the middle of these “I didn't sign up for this” type of situations, we look way too far ahead, and then we get really fearful, and then we start asking the “what ifs,” the “what ifs,” the “what ifs.”

I have a situation in my life right now that is kind of a long game. It's something that you can't see fruit from right now. I may not see fruit in a really long time, and I get really fearful when I go too far ahead, if I jump to a year from now, if I jump to 10 years from now. But what would you say to the listener who really needs help taking it one day at a time? What would you say to her?

Sarah Frazer:
I would say read Lamentations 3. God's mercies are new every morning. I've memorized that: “every morning.” The word “morning” there is, like, the 24-hour period that happens. And I mentioned in the teaching, too, how God designed us to be humans who wake up every morning and have this 24-hour period. It was very hard for me because I am naturally a planner, and I plan super far in the future. I plan, and then I work my way backward. And when we brought our daughter home, there was no way I could plan for her future. And even today, eight years later, she's doing wonderfully. She is an amazing little girl, and she has made so much progress. It's just mind-blowing the progress that she's made. But her future is still unknown. I can't say, "Oh, she's going to get married, and she's going to graduate and get married and have children or go to college and have a career."

I don't know. I don't know what her future holds. And what was the comfort for me was when I realized that God saw her future and that He has orchestrated her future.

Kaley Olson:
That's right.

Sarah Frazer:
And He loves her more than I could ever love her. And His plans … That verse [Psalm 119:89 says] His plans are fixed in heaven — like, His Word and His plans are going to happen. And it takes the pressure off. It takes the pressure off of me to say, “I have to have this figured out.” You don't have to have this figured out today.

Last year, our family went through something really hard, and my immediate response was, "OK, what's the plan?"

Amanda Bacon:
Yes.

Kaley Olson:
Yep.

Sarah Frazer:
What's the plan?

Kaley Olson:
So relatable.

Sarah Frazer:
And there was no plan. We could not make a plan. We were hurting, for one. And second, there was just … Logistically, we couldn't make a plan. And I'll tell you: It's unnerving for me. But I had to learn again last year that it's OK — I could go to sleep each night knowing that I didn't have to have it figured out. It wasn't up to me to have to figure this out. Let me see what we need to do today. Let me see what we need to do this week. And that was all I would plan, just the week ahead. And the pressure is off when you hand that over to the Lord and say, OK, Lord, I'm going to have to trust You through this because I can't make the plan. And it's not up to me.

Kaley Olson:
Yes, totally, for sure. I resonate. I think all women to some degree resonate with that because we carry the mental load of having to think not only for ourselves but our people — and sometimes people who aren't our people who end up somehow, [on the] dotted line, becoming our people.

Amanda Bacon:
Becoming our people.

Kaley Olson:
Yeah. But, Sarah, as we wrap up today, I want to call to attention to something you said that was buried in your response to Amanda. But you said in reference to your daughter, "Now, eight years later, this is what I see God doing in her life."

And I was going to ask you about that, and I don't have to ask you anymore because it sounds like through trusting God through the process and really doing the hard work that you've done to just stick with God through it and trust Him as He has entrusted you with your daughter to be her mom and walk through a hard life that she has … you're so hopeful about it. And that just brings me hope. And for whoever is walking through that — like, Amanda, whatever your situation is — you don't know. Maybe that will be a way that you can respond years later. Or whoever's listening to this, maybe this thing that you're going through right now can be something that one day you'll remember whenever you're going through the next hard thing.

So, Sarah, thank you so much for just the encouragement that you brought to us today. I know it was so refreshing for me and for Amanda and for our listeners. And so we really appreciate you coming onto the show. And so I want to make sure that our listeners get connected with you. Will you share how they can do that?

Sarah Frazer:
Yes. So I am on social media platforms and especially Instagram. But if you go to SarahEFrazer.com — it's F-R-A-Z-E-R — you'll see my website. You can see my book there. And then follow me on social media. But I hang out on Instagram a lot. So @SarahEFrazer on all of those platforms.

Kaley Olson:
Amazing. And you just mentioned your book, and that's another great way our listeners can connect with you and just read through your story and the wisdom that you've learned through this experience. And so be sure, guys, to grab Sarah's book, titled I Didn't Sign Up for This: How to Rest in God's Goodness When Your Story Shifts. You can find that linked below in the show notes.

Amanda Bacon:
That's so good. Your book is so good. Also, friends, don't forget to sign up for our new, free, five-day devotional titled “God Will Get You Through This: Five Devotions for When You Feel Overwhelmed.” And when you sign up, you'll get it right in your inbox for five days in a row.

Kaley Olson:
And that's all for today, friends. For more audio products from Proverbs 31 Ministries, go check out our other two podcasts, called Therapy & Theology with Lysa TerKeurst and the Encouragement for Today Podcast. As always, we believe when you know the Truth and live the Truth, it changes everything.