The Proverbs 31 Ministries Podcast

Kaley:
Well, hello friends. And welcome back to the Proverbs 31 Ministries' podcast, where we share biblical Truth for any girl in any season. I'm your host, Kaley Olson, and here with my friend and guest co-host for the day, Ashley Jackson.

Ashley:
Hi, Kaley. I'm so glad to be here with you today.

Kaley:
I'm so excited you're here too, Ashley. And you guys, you might remember Ashley as a guest co-host from a couple months back, but just in case you don't know her, she is a social media queen for Proverbs 31 Ministries. And so, see any of our reels on social media, they're inspired by this gal right here. But enough about that. Ashley and I just finished recording with our guest teacher today, our friend, Jess Connolly. And Ashley … Whoa.

Ashley:
So good.

Kaley:
What a good message. We talked about body image and I think that's such a sensitive topic. Because I don't know about you, Ashley, but when I think of the words “body image”, I know it's personal and unique to people listening. I have a very different perspective and history with body image than you do. And then, our friend Jess does give a teaching on this today, but no matter what your struggle is with body image or the things that you believe about your body, they all boil down to the same thing. And Jess said that is shame. And so we don't feel like we are good enough for whatever reason. And we feel like we have to hide, and that we're believing these lies that aren't true about ourselves. And so today Jess is going to boil it all down to a kingdom perspective and give us three things to do, to intentionally fight the lies we believe [inaudible 00:01:50] when it comes to our bodies.

Ashley:
Yeah, it's such a powerful message. And we are praying that you will come back to it time and time again. But before we dive into Jess's teaching, in just a minute, I have a super exciting announcement. And that is that we have finalized our keynote speaker lineup for our annual, She Speaks conference that's happening in July. And we are so excited to announce that Jess is actually going to be one of those keynotes. Now, while our in-person conference tickets are sold out, you can still join us online, July 14th through the 15th, to hear from Jess, our President Lysa TerKeurst and so many other amazing speakers who have been exactly where you are. So if you're ready to get started and share your message with the world, She Speaks is a conference to get you there. Check out everything you need to know about the conference at shespeaksconference.com. All right, friends, here's our conversation with Jess.

Kaley:
All right. Well, we are so excited today to be joined by our bestselling author and speaker Jess Connolly. Welcome to the podcast, Jess.

Jess:
Oh, my joy. Thank you for having me, gals.

Kaley:
Well, we know that Jess is joining us today from just a state away in Charleston, South Carolina, which is one of my very favorite places to visit. Let's be honest, if you haven't gone, you've got to go. But Jess leads Bright City Church there with her husband. And she's a longtime friend of the ministry. As long as I've been a part of Proverbs 31, I've always known and heard about
Jess Connolly's name. And so it's super exciting that she's going to be a guest on our podcast episode today. She's an author of several books, but most recently has written one about what we as women believe about our bodies called Breaking Free from Body Shame.

Ashley:
We are so excited for the teaching that you have to share today, Jess, with us. But before we jump into that, I have to know, if all our podcast friend’s road trip to visit you in Charleston, what would you have planned for us today?

Jess:
Well, I need you to know that's our favorite question ever to answer in Charleston. We're very bossy and opinionated about what you do and we want to make sure you do the right things. So I would say we would definitely start off by getting coffee, probably at Harbinger Cafe. We'd get like a little treat, little pastry, maybe a coffee. I would say from there, we need to go walk the bridge. A lot of people are going to take you to the Battery or maybe to a garden, but I'm going to say, "Let's go walk the bridge. Let's see the whole city. Let's look out over the skyline."

Jess:
Then from there, I would take you to Leon's for lunch, where I would highly suggest we get oysters, maybe some Brussel sprouts. And then I would take you to Sullivan's Island Station 19, where we could hang out right now. April in Charleston, May, all a dream. It's a great day to go out. Like you don't even actually have to put on a bathing suit, just put on some clothes, go read a book, have a great afternoon, maybe rest a little bit. And then I would take us to Post House for dinner. So I have, I mean, I have a whole day planned, but I could do that over and over and over again. So ask me again next weekend. I'll probably have a totally different answer.

Ashley:
I like that.

Kaley:
That sounds fantastic. What I love about Charleston is that you can walk to all those places. And so you just mentioned a ton of food. And I was like in order to make room for all of the meals that we're going to eat, we would have to walk everywhere.

Jess:
We'd have to walk. Yeah.

Kaley:
It sounds beautiful. It's my favorite. It's my favorite. OK, well, we're going to pack bags and get to join you in Charleston. But before we do that, we want to just hand the mic over to you so you can dive into your teaching. We're so excited to learn from you. So take it away, Jess.

Jess:
Absolutely. So I have a 14-year-old daughter and she is the light of my life. Her name is Gloriana Eloise. We call her Glory for short and she is full of God's glory. She is full of God's fight too. And I love this about her. But I've noticed this thing developing in the last few years in her life. And that is that we can see the fight coming. We can see her fight coming when she's just in a place. And it's actually pretty helpful —as a mom and as a parent — to notice like, OK, you are in a spot right now. And so, whether I know it's that she's got a lot of pressure going on with school or friends or whether it's hormonal, or whether she's just going to be a little bit tired from work — she's just started working — I can kind of notice the fight coming.

I can see it coming a day or two out. And my husband and I can look at each other and be like, "All right, Glory's in a place. We need to come alongside her. We need to support her." And the only joke in this, the only funny part in this, is that as I've learned to watch the fight kind of rise in Glory, my husband has been really quick to remind me like, “You know this is what it's like to live with you too.” Like you go through seasons of fight, where we had to kind of prep to take care of you. And whether it's your hormones or whether it's spiritual, or whether you're just tired, this kind of ebbs and flows. And it's made me laugh, but it's also made me really pay attention to different fights that I can see coming. And I would caution and encourage all of our listeners today to recognize that with summer approaching, we've got a new fight coming.

And as far as body image is concerned, as far as breaking free from body shame, this is absolutely a year long struggle for all of us. And it's not one that we decided to have. It's not one that we chose for ourself. It's not one that we caused or brought on. This is a fight that was begun in the garden. We actually see, as soon as the fall happens, one of the first emotions that Adam and Eve feel is shame, and specifically shame about their body. And so this is a fight that is as long and as old as the fall. And it's not really a fight that we chose, but it does tend to rear its head at different times of year for a lot of us. And I think with summer approaching, there's often some new fight and some new language that we got to pay attention to.

So whenever I think about fighting, and specifically spiritually fighting, I pay attention to 2 Corinthians 10. It's one of my favorite passages about fighting. And it says, "For though we live in the world, we do not wage war as the world does. The weapons we fight with are not weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ." (2 Corinthians 10:3-5, NIV)

So I love this passage because number one, it wakes us up to the reminder that there is a fight going on. That we aren't just living this life, la dee dah, no big deal. But we are in the midst of some spiritual warfare in all different areas of our life. And I absolutely believe as women of God, one of those areas is how we feel about our bodies, what we think about our bodies and absolutely how we treat our bodies. And so I just have a few quick points for you, as we see this fight coming, so that we can be prepared and we can fight with intention.

So here's number one — I believe one of the best ways we can prepare ourself for this new season of fight that's coming in our bodies is, number one, to acknowledge that there is a fight. There are two sides of this argument and one is absolutely God's side. And so we see, even in this passage, that there are going to be arguments and pretensions that set themselves up against the knowledge of God. And so we have to ask, first of all, what is the knowledge of God? What side is He on? What would He be saying about my body? And on the flip side, what would the enemy of my soul be saying about my body?

As summer approaches, and as we hear these messages about getting bikini body ready, or getting it together so we can go on vacation, we have to kind of just pause and say, what is the fight here? What are the arguments setting themselves up against the knowledge of God? I would conjecture that maybe one is that your value is wrapped up in your beauty. I would say another one is that health is the same as an idealized version of beauty in your culture. And I would even conjecture that another one of those messages that we might be hearing, part of this fight, might be the idea that if we experience brokenness in our bodies, that we should feel shame about that. But the truth is, the knowledge of God, is that He loves us. He's good. He made our bodies with intention and creativity.

And also the knowledge of the Kingdom is that we live under the effects of a fallen world. And so our bodies are going to experience brokenness and pain and aging. And that doesn't mean that something's wrong with us. It means that we're human. So number one, I think we'd be so well benefited to just acknowledge that there is a fight going on as it pertains to our body image, our bodies and how we feel about them.

So here's number two — I think that we have an opportunity, as women of God, to really access some desire for a Kingdom mentality. We know that as Christians and as believers, we can love God. We can love His Word. We can love His church. We can love the people of God. And we can still not have a Kingdom minded mentality about a lot of different things. We can have a worldly mentality that agrees with what the world would be saying, and also what the enemy of our souls would be saying.

And so I would say right here, at the beginning of this particular season of fight, we have an opportunity to say, do I have a Kingdom minded mentality about my body? Do I know the purpose of my body from a Kingdom perspective? Do I know what makes my body good from a Kingdom perspective? Am I trying to run after a worldly ideal? Or am I agreeing with some kingdom truths about this flesh that I live in? I often encourage women with this really good news. The best part about having a Kingdom minded mentality starts in that first word kingdom. And it's that we have a King; You and I have a King. And that actually can shift how we feel about our bodies, what we say about our bodies, how we treat them, how we live in them. But what's so crazy about the fact that we have a King is that we don't just have a King but we have a good and loving and kind King. A savior, and a friend who created our bodies, and also gives them meaning and value and purpose in His Kingdom.

Something else I love about a Kingdom minded mentality is that we know in the Kingdom, what happens here on earth is just a blip. And so the whole purpose of our lives doesn't need to be making our bodies into something that man or men or women or culture would agree with, when the King of the universe has already assigned value and worth to it. I love this truth about having a kingdom minded mentality about our bodies also. I think a lot of us who struggle with body image issues … and statistics would say it's 97% of women are struggling with body image issues. A lot of us are trying to just maybe think about our bodies less. And especially as Christian women, we're wishing we could just think about God more and think about our bodies less.

But what I love about our King is that He's never asked us to pretend like we don't have bodies. He's never asked us to stuff our pain, or to ignore the brokenness of our bodies. Instead, He has mercy and kindness and grace, and He comes toward us with so much compassion. And so I don't believe a Kingdom minded mentality is only thinking about heaven and never thinking about our bodies, but it is just pausing to say, what does God think here? What does He believe here? What has He spoken over my body? And how can I get on that page? And maybe break off some of this worldly mentality that I have about my body.

Here's the third thing I would encourage all of us to just think about as we approach this season, and as we move towards this particular season of fight. I would encourage you and remind you that you can absolutely change the world and fight spiritually just by changing your language. Women often ask me what is a one way I can break free from body shame today? What's one way I can live with a Kingdom minded mentality today? What's one way I can fight this battle spiritually today? And I would say the great news is all of us, every single one of us in the name of Jesus has control over what we say.

Now often we say things we wish we hadn't and then we get to apologize. Or often we get in rhythms or patterns of using different language that we actually don't agree with or we don't believe in, and we can shift and change that. But you, in the name of Jesus today, can actually speak truth and life about your body. You can decide today, no longer will I put negative words or will I put things in my mouth, words in my mouth, that God would not say about this good body that He's created. I won't talk about it the way the world talks about it. I won't defame it. I won't talk about other bodies the way God wouldn't necessarily talk about them.

We can start and we can fight. We can utilize that divine power to demolish strongholds by putting true, good, Holy Spirit filled Bible based words about our bodies in our mouths. But here's what's so crazy about that, we turn back to 2 Corinthians 10, and we hear this reminder that "We demolish arguments in every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God. And we take captive every thought” — not just every word, but every thought— “to make it obedient to Christ” (2 Corinthians 10:5, NIV). And so, in the name of Jesus, I would encourage you with this good news, and this good truth and this tool for fighting against darkness as it pertains to body image, listen to, pay attention to your own thoughts about your body.

And ask, "Does this come under alignment with a Kingdom minded mentality? Do these thoughts and these feelings I have about my body, would they bless the heart of God or would they break the heart of a very good, kind, loving, compassionate King who created me and ascribed value and worth to me, to my life, to my body?” And then even if you feel like, "Oh, these thoughts I'm having, they are not in line with the Kingdom." Don't feel shame about those, but do confess them to God. Ask Him for help to change your mind, change your language, change the culture around you. And therefore we will all together, actually literally change the world as we help ourselves and our generation break free from body shame.

Kaley:
Wow, Jess, I think this is a message that obviously we all need to hear because hearing that staggering statistic from you, that 97% of women —that's basically everyone who listens to this podcast —has at one point or another, or is currently struggling with this. And I feel like this is a conversation that maybe no matter where you are in life, that you're going to have with your friends because you're going to struggle with it. And hearing from you as someone who feels — it feels like you're on the other side of the journey — like you're living in this kingdom minded mentality. But I think it would be helpful for our listeners to hear maybe a little bit more of your journey to figuring out like, Oh, this is something that I’m struggling with and I’ve got to stop it. So can you take us back to however many years ago it was for you? Where were you in your struggle, and what did you do to kind of make the shift into living in that kingdom minded mentality?

Jess:
I love that question so much. Absolutely. So actually for me, it started, my struggle with body image started as soon as I was born. My earliest memories are feeling other or not good in my body, which I think is a very normal story for a lot of women. Unfortunately for me, after I became a believer, I felt like it got even more complicated. Because all of a sudden the negative ways I felt about my body, I now felt like those things also kept me from God. Like they were a part of sin, even though to be totally honest, when I look back on those seasons in my life, my body seemed very good and it seemed very healthy. But I had all of these misunderstandings about what healthy meant and about what it meant to take care of my body.

And I had a lot of mixed up ideas. As I believe, many of us do obviously about the commingling of health and beauty and godliness and righteousness and sin. And so I just spent years really, really, really struggling and feeling more shame, especially after I became a believer than I did before I even met Jesus, about my body. And so for me, it actually was when I really started to step into ministry in a lot of different areas, and God was bringing a lot of freedom and a lot of healing to different parts of my life. I was experiencing healing in like how I viewed myself personally, and my calling and my identity. And I was really beginning to step into a role of encouraging other women and helping to equip them to take God's call on their life. And I was just, I was, again, just experiencing so much freedom and like wild vision and hope and healing.

And then there was this one little part of my body where I still felt like I had to keep everything really contained. And I really still felt like I had to make everybody else happy. And I just started to notice how opposite that was from all of these other areas of spiritual abundance. And so I just started to ask a question with God, like, what do you think here? What do you actually think about my body? And for me, it really started with a lot of unlearning. Paying attention to a lot of the messages, that for me were even potentially from Christian sources or from other believers. But asking, is that what God would say, or even is that how God would say it when speaking about my body? And so it started with a lot of unlearning.

But what's so interesting is a lot of people ask me like, “OK, well, once you broke free from body shame, did you just stop exercising and stop caring about what you ate, et cetera. “And I was like, “Oh gosh, no, for me, actually, it was the exact opposite.” I didn't start really experiencing the freedom to exercise in some life giving until I broke free from body shame. For me, I had felt so much defeat about my body, and about what it could do, that I didn't start running, or I actually ended up becoming a bar instructor after I broke free from body shame. Because all of a sudden I realized I don't have to hide. I don't have to hide this body that isn't necessarily always culturally appropriate. And even moreso, I actually really did start to care about what I ate because I wasn't trying to make my body good, but I was trying to treat it as if it was already good.

Jess:
So I really did want to take care of it, and love it well and nurture it. But none of that was based in shame or trying to make it better anymore.

Kaley:
Wow.

Ashley:
I love that so much. [inaudible 00:23:33] yeah.

Kaley:
Go ahead, Ashley.

Ashley:
Yeah. I just love it so much, because I can relate so much to what you're sharing. I think I went on my first diet when I was like 10 years old. And Jess, I have this vivid memory of like friends coming over, and us ordering pizza and feeling like I cannot eat pizza. Like I am on a diet. And just being so young and being so … that's how we are kind of brought up like you're saying in this society. And I think, I love what you're sharing about the shame piece, because I think it is something that we carry so much shame around. That, like, there's something inherently wrong with us if our bodies don't look like the culture says they should look like.

And I think I've always struggled with this balance, or maybe it's not even a balance, but it feels strange to like, OK, there's my body and there's eating. And then there's like, God and spirituality. And I love this idea of what you're saying about really inviting God into that part because I don't know if that's something I learned or I told myself. But like, God doesn't really care. God doesn't care that, I know that He cared that I struggled, but does He care what I eat? Does He care about that kind of thing? And I think like what you're saying, what's really hitting me is letting God love that part of us that has struggled for years. And I think my question maybe for you too, is how did you let God love you in the middle of something that maybe you've always shamed yourself over?

Jess:
Such a good question. And it really … letting God into this piece of our life is so wild because it actually really does impact everything. I think the biggest thing I would just encourage women with, number one, I mean, the why behind this is really impacting how you feel about God. Because even what you just said is so powerful, that you thought God didn't care about how you felt about your body. And I think a lot of us are walking around believing that, like He doesn't care about this or He's disappointed. He's just utterly frustrated with me. He's tired of me having this struggle. And those are really human characteristics, not God characteristics. And so even just pausing to ask, like, what am I, where did this message come from, is so powerful.

So I just appreciate you saying that. But yeah, how did I let Him love me in it? I'm a big proponent of just feeling in front of God and saying real words to God about how we feel. One of my favorite stories in the Bible is when the disciples ask Jesus how to pray, which I think is so beautiful. It's actually one of the only things with the … we have recorded the disciples ask Jesus how to do. And — but I love it because they are asking God how to talk to God. It's like the cutest, how do we do this?

And I think we get tripped up all the time in the same way. Like how do I, how do I, wait, hold on. How do I do this with God? And I think the answer is we talk to God about our bodies. I think God actually really wants to hear when we're like, "Hey, I feel confused. I feel shame. I feel stressed. I feel worried. I feel like I'm on the hook here. I feel pressure. I feel disappointed." I mean, just telling Him, "I feel disappointed about what my body's dealing with." I think that is everything thing. I think it's the key. And I think what we're going to find when we actually do that. And I just trust God so much in this because, because He's just good. I think we're going to find His compassion and His grace and His kindness and His peace, when we just tell Him how we feel. So I think that's one of the best ways to start.

Kaley:
Yeah. Yeah. That's great. And I feel like Jess, what you're speaking is making me think that I cannot look to anyone else to remind me that my body is good right now, or what I'm doing is good enough, or what I'm wearing is flattering because it's like that affirmation is only so temporary. And only God is going to be able to kind of settle my heart so that I don't have to worry about that anymore. But it's just, it's interesting to me how we're kind of always looking for that affirmation or attention — especially in such a social media driven world — for other people to tell us that we are good, but it's only going to last so long. And so I love that you're reminding us to get to the root of the issue and just be honest with God. Because only when we have that connection and conversation with God, is when He’s going to give us that lasting peace that helps us not to worry so much about what other people think or always rely on someone else's opinion to get us through the next 24 hours.

And so thank you so much for this message. I know it's so needed. And if this message was meaningful to you, maybe you right now are sitting in your car or at the park listening to this, and you're struggling with this and you want to know, how do I learn how to do this better? Well,
Jess wrote a book called Breaking Free from Body Shame where she dives into this. And you can read it and learn more about the message that God has given her. And you can use the link in our show notes at proverbs31.org/listen to purchase that book.

And then I don't know if you guys follow Jess on Instagram, but I do. And one, she does in fact run. She posts pictures of herself running all around the streets of Charleston, she literally runs the city. But a lot of other encouraging things. And so I think that social media can be a tool used for good, not necessarily always used for something to remind you that you're not enough, but it can be a tool used for good. Jess does that. And so you can find her on Instagram at @Jessaconnolly.

Ashley:
Yeah. And lastly, we are so excited to announce that Jess is a keynote at this year's She Speaks conference. Our in-person conference tickets are sold out, but you can still join us online, July 14th through the 15th, to hear from Jess, our President Lysa TerKeurst and other amazing speakers who have been exactly where you are. So if you're ready to get started, and share your message with the world, She Speaks is a conference to get you started. So you can check out everything you need to know about the conference at shespeaksconference.com.

Kaley:
Yeah. We're so excited to get to hang out with Jess more. It's going to be great. Yes. All right, friends, that is all for today. I'm so glad that you joined us and want to remind you that we're all about truth here at Proverbs 31 Ministries. We believe when you know the truth, know the truth of God's word, it changes everything. See you next time.